Thursday, December 10, 2009

Daily drudgery....

I should like to bring my daily drudge before you, O Lord - the long hours and days crammed with everything else but you. Look at this daily drudge, my gentle God, you who are merciful to us men and women for whom daily drudge is virtually all we are. Look at my soul, which is virtually nothing but a street on which the world's baggage cart rolls along with innumerable trivialities, with its gossip and fuss, with its noisiness and empty pretension.

A prayer of Karl Rahner!

Monday, December 7, 2009

To share joy.

Joy is meant to be shared. This is especially true in a religous context. The first Christians stood in awe before the mighty deeds of the apostles (Ac.2:43). They “feared” God. But this had nothing to do with anxiety and panic. We read in the same description that they broke bread with joy and that they praised God. In a simple way they experienced happiness when they had their meals together, but in the deeper, spiritual life, they could also praise God with much joy (Ac.2:47).

The sharing of joy is an essential characteristic of a community of believers. And it is fascinating to see how the church is formally structured to express this joy:

To worship God with hymns and song is one of the most important ways of expressing joy. Music, especially music that touches one, can make worship a special experience. People would remark after a service that the music was beautiful. They sing hymns with extraordinay enthusiasm when they are together in joy. When one sings special words with beautiful music it can inspire one and transform one in a deep spiritual manner. It is one of the most fitting ways to express joy in worshipping God. Then one is also truly celebrating the love of God as the true source of joy.

But joy is also communicated in proclaiming the Word of God. The preacher who lives from the gospel, the good, joyful news, will radiate joyful words. And it is not possible to communciate joy when one is innerly desperate, broken, without hope and overcome by depression. But to proclaim joy does not mean, however, that one has to smile all the time or that one has to feel happy all the while. It is a disaster when one wants to fake joy or to exaggerate one’s happiness.

Joy can be subdued, sober, simple. On Good Friday it is the death of Christ which is celebrated, remembered joyfully. On such a day joy is expressed differently than on the day of celebrating Christmas or Pentecost. When we say farewell to a loved one who has died, one can feel much joy amidst the sorrow of loss and bereavement. It is a joy because of having been blessed by the life and presence of the one who has died. It is joy because of so much happiness which we had shared with the one who has died.

Joy can be there, even in the times of great adversity, because of the never-ending presence of God in our lives. We can be joyful in sorrows, writes Paul in 2 Corinthians. He knew – he sang songs of joy in jail. Ultimately we feel joy because God shares divine blessings with us.

We feel happiness because we share it with the Other.

Sunday, December 6, 2009

To see and taste God (Ps.34:9). What is mysticism?

There is little doubt who the great mystics in history are. A number of names immediately come to mind. There are Hildegard of Bingen and Bernard of Clairvaux from the 11th century, Meister Ekchart from the 13th century, Jan van Ruusbroec and Juliana of Norwich from the 14th century, Ignatius van Loyola from the 16th century and many others. These authors were key figures in the history of mysticism.

It is interesting that they are described as “mystics.” We read their texts and we know intuitively that they are about mysticism. But at the same time differences come to the fore as soon as we start discussing the nature of mysticism, It is clear that mysticism can be understood in different ways. Scholem (Die jüdische Mystik; 6-7)who wrote important publications on mysticism, thinks that we can begin to understand mysticism by noting the simple remark in Psalm 34:9. “Taste and seeing that the Lord is good.” Mysticism is about the intimate way in which the presence of God is experienced directly and immediately. The goodness of God is tasted and seen.


This verse makes us aware of what may seem like a contradiction. God who is so completely different than creation, can be so intimately in a relationship with creation that the divine goodness can be tasted and seen.

This focus on an intimate relationship with the divine is a general trend in mysticism. On the one hand mysticism has to do with what is unthinkable – it brings us before the divine which transcends our reality. It has to do with experiencing the divine presence. And then, secondly, this amazing phenomenon, that Creator and creation interact in an intimate way, is then to be expressed in human language.

Here we have to do with the conflict between mystical thought (human thoughts and words) and mystical experience (our experience of faith). We struggle with this already on a most elementary level when we triy to explain to others what happened when we experienced the divine touch.

I liked the Scholem’s remarks about this. He wanted to emphasise that people have a religious experience which is unique. It is an experience which transforms and changes everything. Someone is distanced from his or her own being (an ecstatic experience). It is an infinite experience. The inner being of someone is lifted up to the highest level (“den endlichen Aufschwung der Seele zur höchsten Stufe).

And yet Scholem writes, one should be careful about reducing mystical texts to this insight. There are some authors who do not like to speak of mysticism as "unification with God." They think that such an understanding eliminates the borders between God and humanity. They are wary of associating the mystical experience with the divinisation of a human being – something which is often the case in contemporary contexts in which pantheism has become so prominent.

This description of mysticism as unification is in any case very wide. There is not really something like an experience of unification with God in religions. This abstract formulation is an attempt to help us in a general way to understand mystical texts. In reality we have a mystical authors who wrote in language of the time about their experience of faith. Mysticism always has a specific character and context. We should therefore always ask how Jews, Buddhists, Muslims, Anglicans, Lutherans, Calvinists, wisdom teachers, rabbis, laity, monastics, Desert Fathers and any others spoke about their mystical experiences. It is similar to music. Music is about an octave of eight notes which produces sound and which has an impact on people. But music will sound very differently where Bono and U2 or a symphonic orhestra or a jazz band perform.

But there is also another important facet which must be emphasised. Anyone can play a few notes on the piano and think he or she is on the way to stardom. Music, however, is more than loosely connected notes. Mystics did not have a vague feeling of divine intervention or some relationship with God. They also did not have one or other vague feeling of divinisation. For them it was not a matter of a human being reaching an extraordinary state. They thought in the language of their time and context about the indescribable, unfathomable touch of God which transformed someone and changed his or her life completely. And each of them expressed their unique experience in a particular form.

Taken as example Jewish mysticism. Scholem writes that the early Jewish mystics never spoke of unification with God, although we could say that this is what their texts are about. It is a vital characteristic of Jewish mysticism that God remains completely different in the divine relationship with humanity. God is so overwhelmingly different that the one who sees God, dies – as is remarked in Hebrew Scriptures. And yet, mystics experienced God in an intimate manner. They spoke of special, personal experiences which brought them, in mystical ways, to seek God. Mystical authors would express fundamental experience in different ways according to the context and time.

An example of this would be Jewish mystics of the second century. They expressed their mystical experience of God in terms of language from their time and context. They used especially Isaiah 6 and Ezekiel 1 with their throne visions. In both these visions the visionaries stand in awe before the transcendent majesty and glory of God and experience their own unholy existience in an acute manner. The point is that, like Isaiah and Jeremiah, these mystics express their experience by speaking of their journey to the heavenl y regions and their presence before the throne of God. In these regions they are given heavenly secrets which are vitally important for their future existence. God is transforming them and bringing new life to them.

Later on, however, the Chassidim used much lesser symbolic language in their depiction of their mystical experiences. One of them explained his mystical experience as follows, “Many people serve God with their human understanding. Others, however, contemplate the divine ‘ nothingness.’ The special mystical experience given to people who are regarded as worthy, is beyond all human comprehension. But after this vision and experience of God en returns to one's normal state and comprehension, but now one is filled by divine glory.”


Mysticism is therefore not a simple matter of speaking about an encounter with God. It is a special experience which is expressed with much difficulty in human language. Where these texts are finally written down and read, they have an extraordinary impact. In them people recognise the deepest meaning of life. They contront the reader with the Mystery of our existence. It is only in the direct, mystical encounter with the divine that humanity finds complete peace.

Saturday, December 5, 2009

Joy comes to those who search for it.

I met someone today who told me about his difficult times six years ago when he was involved in a divorce. Dark, depressive thoughts overshadowed his existence. Now, six years later, having met someone whom he loves greatly, he can hardly imagine those extremely negative experiences which brought his into a deep depression – they now seem so unreal to him.

In his life joy and sadness are clearly closely linked. Like many, as we saw in the blog yesterday, he also experienced how his life offers both its sad and its joyful moments. This is real: life is not only about joy. Faith is not only triumphant. It fails and it know unhappiness. At that time, though, he seemed to have lost this perspective. For him life was simply a prolonged, sad experience.

The point is whether we allow our sadness to overshadow our existence. Often we allow our deep thoughts to dominate what we feel and how we live. We cannot relativise our feelings. It is difficult to say to ourselves: “but one day there will be the good times again.”

Our life is about much more than the sadness and unhappiness that we must occasionally experience. Life is about denying sadness the upper hand. It is about challenging ourselves not to become a victim of our disappointments.

This is easier said than done. My friend would not have appreciated it if someone told him six years ago not to worry since there will be good times again in the future. He would not have liked to hear that he is too overwhelmed and obsessed by his negative feelings.

But then, what does one do in such times other than sharing one’s grief with God and thus moves away from grief? As we experience deep inner anguish and loneliness, we may feel abandoned by God and all else. But these negative feelings bring us to seek God so that we can be reunited with the divine presence.

On the one hand, one could accept such times as part of life and then see it as a challenge which one should face and which one should see as a time to be stripped from everything which keeps one from seeking God. This means letting our sadness go, allocating to them only a restricted place in our lives.

Or we can also see these times as the divine invitation to seek God as the Father who cares for those who are unhappy. One needs to enter the sphere of Fatherly love, to seek the intimate closeness to God, so that one can be touched by the divine joy. It may be difficult to seek God since we are so overwhelmed by our loneliness and sadness. We become so preoccupied by these negative feelings that it is difficult to break away from them.

And yet, this is what we need to do – to seek God’s presence which brings us inner peace and joy. For many who suffer such negative feelings, the road to healing will be steep. Searching in God does not always mean that we will experience joy instantly.

Most probably we shall find that our healing takes a long time and comes gradually. As we seek God in our sadness, it may be that we experience but one tiny moment of graceful joy and sense of belonging with God who cares for us, only to feel much sadness again. It is like a journey per foot on a road by night without any light. We walk carefully and haltingly. But then a car speeds by and we see that we are still on the right road and we recognize the direction in whcih we should travel. That one moment of light brings a sense of direction in our lives.The one moment of joy may bring the relief and begin the process of healing.

Relief from sadness does not always come easily. But when we search for it, we shall not be disappointed. Joy comes only to those who reach out to it....

Often as we walk through dark days, we despair. But then invariably, later on we say: if I now look back I can only say that it was by the grace of God....

Our sadness should not speak the last word in our lives.

Friday, December 4, 2009

On happiness. Joy does not fall from the sky.

This week one of the brave opponents of the apartheid system and a most respected journalist, decided to end his life. He shot himself, having told his friends that he was fed up with what was happening in our country. His death was front page news, with some of our most distinguished leaders appealing to those in power to understand that his death signals to hem how crime and corruption are driving people to acts of extreme desperation. There is in our land deep depression as our social fabric falls apart.

The journalist’s death affected me deeply. As a young man, I often felt inspired by his fearless stand against apartheid. When others in high moral positions supported a devastating racist political system, cut off all debates and ostracised those who dared to express dissent and opposition (him included), his lonely, brave voice gave us hope and strengthened us in our own opposition to the system. I respected the integrity with which he wrote and fought an often lonely battle against injustice – something he did throughout his life.

But I am writing this because of something else I read yesterday. I was reading a book by Anselm Grün on spirituality in which he writes about joy. He writes about the fact that our society knows so little joy and that we perpetuate and intensify our feelings of misery by our constant negative attitudes and pronouncements.

I kept on reflecting on what he writes – especially because joy is so vital. Joy in life is not just an emotion that makes our existence a pleasure or provides us with good feelings. Joy is a key to survival. If we lose our joy in life, we often arrive at a point where we completely give up on life.

As a contrast to this miserable situation, Grün draws attention to the fact that the Bible is full of feasts which are celebrated with much joy. For this one only has to read the Psalms. The deeper life of which the Bible speaks, is a life of joy.

But, and this is the point, life, even in the Bible is not merely about joy. The best Biblical symbols of this is the slavery in Egypt, the wearisome journey through the desert to the promised land, the cross and the suffering of the first Christian witnesses.What is true of the Bible, is simply also true of life. We experience in our everyday existence wonderful moments of joy, but then, in a moment, it can be taken away from us by one negative word, a news article, an angry look, a word of criticism or a seemingly insignificant event – all of which can makes us sad and miserable. Life has its beautiful moments, but also its moments of sadness.

Life does not only consist of joy. And religion has nothing to do with a permanent state of joy. Life is also sad. There are the moments, also for those with faith, that one wakes up and does not want to face the day ahead.

There are days when we have no courage, that we are lost in emotions of despair and fear. That we are angry, upset, violent. There are times that we get ill, fall in debt, worry about the future – all of which make us sad. There is no one who can escape this darker side of human existence. Even the most happy people experience moments of sadness.

The difference between the Bible with its happy and sad moments on the one hand and contemporary society with its misery, is that some people become victims of their sadness. When they look at life, sadness dominates and overshadows all moments of light – to the extent that the good no longer exists for them.

Others understand that life is much more than sadness. Why should one let the darker moments overshadow the moments of fulfillment, of joy, of meaning - however fleeting or small they may be? Why should one be conquered by fears and unhappiness? Life is ultimately about much more. It becomes a matter of perspective: does one look at sadness as the end of happiness or does one look as sadness which happens, but which is ultimately overshadowed by happiness.

One can become so obsessed with darkness and depression, that one succumbs to them and is destroyed by them. Despair becomes a spiral movement in which one is constantly drawn deeper and deeper. In Biblical times believers somehow managed in their darkest moments to hold on to the light, the deeper things that really matter. In jail, engulfed by darkness, Paul and Silas sang songs of joy at midnight, the darkest time of the night. Their secret was that they sang hymns “to God” (Ac.16:25). They were aware of the divine presence in their midst – something which transformed their situation.

It was the same Paul who advised his readers to be joyful. But he knew he had to add, quite tellingly, that they needed to rejoice “in the Lord” (Phil4:4). And, finally, he also added, that they should rejoice “always.” It was a challenge to them – he knew such joy has to be sought. It does not fall from the sky.

On happiness. Joy does not fall from the sky.

This week one of the brave opponents of the apartheid system and a most respected journalist, decided to end his life. He shot himself, having told his friends that he was fed up with what was happening in our country. His death was front page news, with some of our most distinguished leaders appealing to those in power to understand that his death signals to hem how crime and corruption are driving people to acts of extreme desperation. There is in our land deep depression as our social fabric falls apart.

The journalist’s death affected me deeply. As a young man, I often felt inspired by his fearless stand against apartheid. When others in high moral positions supported a devastating racist political system, cut off all debates and ostracised those who dared to express dissent and opposition (him included), his lonely, brave voice gave us hope and strengthened us in our own opposition to the system. I respected the integrity with which he wrote and fought an often lonely battle against injustice – something he did throughout his life.

But I am writing this because of something else I read yesterday. I was reading a book by Anselm Grün on spirituality in which he writes about joy. He writes about the fact that our society knows so little joy and that we perpetuate and intensify our feelings of misery by our constant negative attitudes and pronouncements.

I kept on reflecting on what he writes – especially because joy is so vital. Joy in life is not just an emotion that makes our existence a pleasure or provides us with good feelings. Joy is a key to survival. If we lose our joy in life, we often arrive at a point where we completely give up on life.

As a contrast to this miserable situation, Grün draws attention to the fact that the Bible is full of feasts which are celebrated with much joy. For this one only has to read the Psalms. The deeper life of which the Bible speaks, is a life of joy.

But, and this is the point, life, even in the Bible is not merely about joy. The best Biblical symbols of this is the slavery in Egypt, the wearisome journey through the desert to the promised land, the cross and the suffering of the first Christian witnesses.What is true of the Bible, is simply also true of life. We experience in our everyday existence wonderful moments of joy, but then, in a moment, it can be taken away from us by one negative word, a news article, an angry look, a word of criticism or a seemingly insignificant event – all of which can makes us sad and miserable. Life has its beautiful moments, but also its moments of sadness.

Life does not only consist of joy. And religion has nothing to do with a permanent state of joy. Life is also sad. There are the moments, also for those with faith, that one wakes up and does not want to face the day ahaed.

There are days when we have no courage, that we are lost in emotions of despair and fear. That we are angry, upset, violent. There are times that we get ill, fall in dept, worry about the future – all of which make us sad. There is no one who can escape this darker side of human existence. Even the most happy people, know their moments of sadness.

The difference between the Bible with its happy and sad moments on the one hand and contemporary society with its misery is that some become victims of their sadness. When they look at life, sadness dominates and overshadows all moments of light – to the extent that the good no longer exists for them. Others understand that life is much more than sadness. Why should one let the darker moments overshadow the moments of fulfillment, of joy, of meaning? Why should one be conquered by fears and unhappiness? Life is ultimately about much more. It becomes a matter of perspective: does one look at sadness as the end of happiness or does one look as sadness which happens, but which is ultimately overshadowed by happiness.

One can become so obsessed with darkness and depression, that one succumbs to them and are destroyed by them. It becomes a spiral movement in which one is constantly drawn deeper and deeper. In Biblical times believers somehow managed in their darkest moments to hold on to the light, the deeper things that really matters. In jail, engulfed by darkness, Paul sang songs of joy at midnight. The secret was that they sang hymns “to God” (Ac.16:25). They were aware of the divine presence in their midst – something which transformed their situation.

It was the same Paul who advised his readers to be joyful. But he knew he had to add, quite tellingly, that they need to rejoice “in the Lord” (Phil4:4). And, finally, he also added, that they should rejoice “always.” It was a challenge to them – he knew such joy has to be sought. It does not fall from the sky.

Thursday, December 3, 2009

The Bible as Word of God

We speak of the Bible as the “Word of God.” We think of the “Word of God” often as a "book" with pages which we read and study. And we see ourselves as believers who are people of the Book. This “bookishness” of our faith, sometimes tend to make us think that we are not as privileged as the disciples of Jesus. They had Jesus, they could listen to Him, hear Him ad follow Him. We, however, no longer are with Jesus. We “only” have words of Jesus.

But is is not that simple. Luke begins his first story in his Gospel with the wonderful narrative about two devoted Bible students: Zechariah and Elizabeth, the parents of John the Baptist, receive the announcement of his birth. They are described as observant of “all the Lord’s commandments and regulations blamelessly” (Luke 1:6). This is spirituality: they are transformed by their relationship with God. Their relationship with God is determined by God’s word, the law. The words of the Lord shape them, become a reality in their lives and remain the source of their ongoing devotion to God. They “only” have a Bible, but they live wholeheartedly from this Word of God.

Luke’s story about these two people therefore also includes God’s story in their lives. They know the divine words given to Moses. They are inspired by what Moses heard from God and what was later recorded as God’s will to Moses in the Old Testament as part of our Bible. The story about Moses is the heart of the story of Luke and of these people’s lives. In the history of Moses we have two stages: Moses experiences the divine word – and he becomes the messenger who brings this word to the people of God. He is a minister of the word.

But note that there is another “story” in this first narrative: The story of Moses is linked with the story of Gabriel. The angel brings God’s word to Zechariah and Elizabeth. He, Gabriel, tells them, “I stand in the presence of God and I have been sent to speak to you and tell you this good news.” They hear from the angel the Word of God, the Gospel, the Good News. Gabriel heart God’s Word and communicates it to them. Like Moses who received the Word from God, Gabriel also becomes a witness to the Word.

Thus begins the gospel of Jesus- with the Word of God to these two people. It is a powerful word. It transforms them, changes them and they become messengers of the Good News. Long before the birth of Jesus, the Gospel is heard!

We do not “read” a Bible or “merely” study a “book.” We, like the believers in the time of Jesus and like Jesus himself, have the Word of God which changes and transforms people’s livers in an irreversible manner. The Bible as Word of God contains many smaller “Words of God.” Jesus too lives from the Word of God. He preaches from the Word, for example, in the synagogue (Luke 4) and in the Sermon on the Mount. He heard the Word of God, for example, when he was baptized. And he became the Messenger, the one who witnessed to the Word of God and who embodied the Gospel of Good News.

Now Jesus has left, but we still live from God’s word – like people of all times. We have more than a Book. We are not less privileged than people in the time of Jesus. We also can live from God’s Word which inspires us to become messengers.

No wonder Luke adds a prologue to his gospel in which he talks about the words of Jesus which he wrote down. His book is meant to write the words of Jesus in the most reliable manner (Luke 1:1-4). He knew how vital God’s Word was. It was the Word from which Jesus lived – as he testified to Satan during the temptation, which set the hearts of the Emmaus disciples aflame, which made them witness even though Jesus disappeared from their sight and it was the Word which brought the Ethiopian to be baptized and which filled his life with joy.

Wednesday, December 2, 2009

In complete amazement:. The presence of God in our lives.

We can talk, pray, meditate and listen to God without experiencing God.

Acts begins quite soberly with a last discussion between Jesus and his disciples in which He tells them what will happen after his ascension (Ac.1:1-10). Jesus promises them the Holy Spirit who will empower them to become witnesses (Ac.1:8-9). They then return to Jerusalem, as Jesus asked them (Ac.1:4), where they pray and elect a successor for Judas (Ac.1:12-26). There is a lot of talking, reflection, meditating and praying going on in this introductory passage. They are busy, these disciples,as they respond to the message of Jesus and awaits what will happen.

And yet, there are also indications of something extraordinary in this passage. It focusses strongly on the Holy Spirit as the promise from the Father (Ac.1:4; but esp. 1:33) who would empower them to become witnesses. Characteristic of spirituality the passage focusses therefore on God’s relationship with humanity through the gift of the Spirit who will transform the disciples. Whilst there are references to God’s initiative and actions to deepen the divine relationship with humanity, the disciples from their side also respond to the divine actions by their prayers and the election of someone to succeed Judas. These are all precursors to the acts of empowerment which are to follow and which would bring humanity to do extraordinary things. The resurrection is not enough. That was just the beginning. Now follows the process of transformation. But the moment of empowerment is prepared by their accepting attitude to what Jesus wants from them – to return to Jerusalem – and their prayers. At the same time they also quite practically prepare for the gift of empowerment by appointing a successor to Judas. In this way not only God, but the disciples also are actively at work to nurture and intensify their mutual relationship. It is indeed a process of growth in a relationship: intense discussions as a group with Jesus, careful consideration of what He wants from them, prayerful response and preparation for what is to follow and practical arrangements for the future.

All these things illustrate various aspects of the growing relationship of God with humanity and the loving response of humanity to the divine actions in their lives. It has to do with divine gifts, support – but also about farewell, about new forms of relationship. At the same time there is devotion, obedience, retreat, discernment of God’s will and trust on the divine guidance. The relationship between God and humanity takes on many forms and varies constantly. It is indeed a journey in which this relationship develops in various forms and ways.

But there is something unique to this first phase of Acts in that everything comes to completion on the day of Pentecost. Everything is directed to and is preparation for this event: it is the day on which the divine promises become a reality and the Spirit touches and changes people forever. What was expected previously, is experienced on this day. Here a divine fire burns in people. They are inspired by a Spirit of love in the service of God. Perhaps even because they awaited it so intensely, their experience is so intense.... It is the great moment of transformation.

It is easy to reduce Pentecost to a moment that people are being empowered and transformed. They become fearless witnesses, we say. But Pentecost is about much more than this. People are changed, but they become people who worship God in amazement as the God of power who is present in their lives. It is not what they would do on that day, which makes most sense. It is what God did and what God is doing and God’s fulfilling presence which is what everything is all about.

This is clear in the simple description of the Pentecost events. A heavenly sound “from heaven” fills the house and fire tongues descends on each one of them. Heaven descends to earth. And then, according to Acts 2:11, they proclaim the mighty deeds of God. It is the divine presence and deeds which fill their hearts and make them break out in spontaneous witness. Pentecost is for Luke the coming of the Lord (Ac.2:20). It is the day of the Lord’s coming in power and glory. God is present among us through the Holy Spirit.

Pentecost is a powerful reminder that God desires a relationship with us which is intimate: ultimately God is with us as God who is stronger than death. We must remember and meditate on this constantly. From the very beginning God was with us as the fire of love who renews us.

We can speak, think, meditate and even pray without really experiencing the presence of God. Pentecost reminds us that ultimately we have to experience our faith as contemplation – as the refreshing, powerful experience of the divine presence. On this day our prayerful waiting is over – what we expected, is finally a reality. Our longing for God is transformed into our joy in the divine presence. Finally, finally we experience the God of fire and of love....

Tuesday, December 1, 2009

What is Spirituality? On walking pass a treasure

On the plane from Windhoek I read this joke:

Two professors in economics walk down the street and see a R200 banknote on the pavement. As they walk pass the note, the first one comments:

"Look someone dropped a R200 note. What a careless and stupid thing to do," said professor A.

A few meters further the other one suddenly says:

"It cannot be genuine,"otherwise someone else would have picked it up."

A wonderful little story which could be used to explain Spirituality...... One sees the special treasure and walks past it....